Print Reseller Scheme
  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.


Discussion in 'General Business Forum:' started by Dan_masoomi, Feb 17, 2012.

  1. Dan_masoomi

    Dan_masoomi Member

    hello everyone sorry but a little more advice

    just got a job for a firm and they have asked me to do the following on a freelance basis.

    design the layout of a 8 page website

    logo design

    business cards

    letter heads

    a3 poster

    a5 4 page brocure and tear off order form.

    i have 9 days till deadline. plus juggle uni work so its a heavy deadline!

    i have to give a quote before i can start the work so if anyone could give me quotes they would charge so i could get a kind of feel to how much i should charge.

    Freelance Design Service - DMD Designs thats my site so you can see the standard of work

    if anyone would prefer to pm me prices i will keep it confidential. just not sure where else to ask in such a short space of time.

    thanks very much to anyone who is kind enough to help me out

  2. Levi

    Levi Moderator Staff Member

    what 9 days to do the work or 9 days to put the quote in....
  3. Dan_masoomi

    Dan_masoomi Member

    to do the work
  4. Jimlad

    Jimlad Well-Known Member

    Try and work out how long it'll take you to do it all, or each, then multiply that by your hourly rate (average is apparently between £25-£35).
  5. Krey20

    Krey20 Senior Member

    As Jimlad suggested plus a little more for the very tight work schedule. That's a lot of work to fit into 9 days.
  6. Jimlad

    Jimlad Well-Known Member

    Not just 9 days tho is it, he's got uni work during those 9 days too! I might have suggested more time. You can almost guarantee they'll want to make the odd alteration or several too. If its done and dusted in 9 days or less, I'll find a hat just so I can take it off to you.
  7. balders

    balders Member

    4k for everything listed then alterations at an hourly rate.

    I'm sure you could put your uni work on hold for a bit, this is what you want to get into right?

    Never under sell yourself.
  8. Levi

    Levi Moderator Staff Member

    I had a feeling you'd say 9 days to complete the work....I wouldn't be trying to juggle that load and uni work over 9 days.... you'll likely lose 1-2 days just from waiting on feedback
  9. Squiddy

    Squiddy Guest

    Yeah, I can see a company paying a student £4k...

    9 days is definitely not a lot of time for so much work, which leads me to believe that they aren't a particularly organised company. I imagine they are using you because you're a student and they may feel they can impose such difficult terms because as a student you might be lacking alternative jobs. Either that or they are clueless in regards to how long design work takes - maybe this is their first time dealing with an external designer? Who knows.

    Regardless of the reason, that's a lot of work and very little time to do it in which is made even more difficult by the fact that you will have to sacrifice your uni work in some way to ensure it's all done.

    I would then give them two pricing options. You work flat out for those 9 days and get it completed within the deadline (You will definitely want to establish ground rules on alterations as this can often be the most time consuming aspect of completing a project) and you take what you would normally charge and either increase that by 50% or 100%. The alternative is to accept the work for your standard rate/lower price and have them extend the deadline.

    In regards to your charges, have you completed any similar projects prior to this one which you can use as a guide to your current pricing? I know Jimlad mentioned £25 - £35 but when you consider that at £35 an hour working 40 hours a week you'd be earning a gross income of £67,200. Maybe there are some students out there on that level of income but that would most definitely be an exception to the rule. Even at £25 an hour for 40 hours a week you would be on £48k a year, which in my opinion is not a very realistic figure for someone who is new to such an industry.

    I think realistically as a student you will be looking for something closer to £10 - £20 an hour depending on how good you are at negotiating and presenting yourself professionally. If you are going to be working £x per hour, make sure that you inform this company what you will be charging for and document it well. If you go from start to finish with no communication on the matter, they aren't going to be too happy when you turn round with a large bill as they weren't aware of what they were being charged for. (Believe it or not some people think that unlimited revisions shouldn't be paid for!)

    You should keep in mind that the size of the company will play a large factor into how this goes, is it a small or large company? I'm guessing it's going to be a small company of between 2 - 10 employees. If that is the case then be aware that by quoting too high you will put them off - it's a trade off though, do you want the work, do you need it? Is there potential for future work from this client? How much will this affect your uni work?

    Maybe something which will help you a little more, I would possibly charge the following - IF it were a very small company 1/2 people:

    Website Design (I assume no coding): £150
    Print Design: £250 for all that you mentioned
    Total: £400

    Revisions: 2 free revisions per item, i.e. business card/logo etc to total no more than 1 hour of work per item. Anything extra will be charged at an hourly rate of £15 p/h

    Now, if they want that within 9 days I would charge a total of £500 - £600 and £20 per hour for additional changes after their first 2.

    As I mentioned it entirely depends on your client, their financial position, if they can get someone else to do it or not, how they perceive your ability to deliver etc etc so make the adjustments you need to and you should be good to go. If they turn their noses up then they are probably a bad client who you will regret working for in the future if you buckle to any kind of extortionately low price requests.
  10. balders

    balders Member

    £400 for 9 days work @8 hour days is below minimum wage for anyone aged over 21. £500 is only just over minimum wage.

    I'm glad your not my boss.

    I was submitting our company advert to one of the publications we advertise in, the person I was dealing with informed me they offered a design service. 1/4 page advert for £950. My jaw dropped.

    The AV company I used to work for would book out the inhouse designers at £750 a day. That included the junior fresh out of univ.

    If they are booking you for work your experience level shouldn't come into it. Next time I have my hair cut or get a plumber round I'll pay them less if they are new to the job and see how that goes down.
  11. Squiddy

    Squiddy Guest

    This issue is not nearly as simple as you make it out to be, there are a lot of different factors that can and should affect the overall price, none of which you seem to take into account.
  12. balders

    balders Member

    You could keep factoring till the cows come home. I agree there should be a few basic ground rules, good communication and a face to face visit if possible. But its as complicated as you want to make it.
  13. Squiddy

    Squiddy Guest

    Well, yeah, that's business - complicated. If it was that simple everyone would be doing it, moreover, doing it well. You have to take into account so many different factors because there are so many varying factors between any two graphic designers; Employment type, experience, level of professionalism, level of skill, business strength, clients alternatives, clients financial stability etc etc the list, as you rightly point out, is as complicated as you want to make it.

    You can say that these factors don't matter, but they quite simply do. Simply put, if he charges more than they are willing to pay then he won't get the job. Now, the factor of job importance to the designer would then decide whether that's something to care about or not. Does he really need this job, the money it provides? Does he have other jobs/clients he can be working with instead?

    Remember that this isn't all about graphic design, it's also about business management. Whether he wants to become self employed or become an employee is one of those factors that remains unknown. If he does want to become self employed then these are the kind of things that he's going to have to start learning about.

    It's a wonderful idea that every graphic design student can go straight from uni to earning £60k + a year/pro rata, but I fear those figures are about as realistic as the world in which this happens.
  14. mcskillz

    mcskillz Member

    Squiddy freelancers /self employed can't factor working 40 chargeable hours per week. it simply doesn't work like that. You have to think about non chargeable time like administration and such.

    So even those charging at £35 per hour won't be bringing in £68k ish a year most likely.
  15. Squiddy

    Squiddy Guest

    Well, there's a big difference between being a freelance graphic designer and being self employed with your own studio/office and employees. mcskillz, I added the /pro rata for a reason. The fact is that if you're not charging for things such as administration then you're doing your business a great disservice because as you rightly point out, this is work and actually you need to be remunerated for time spent doing these tasks. People need to find a way to factor this work into the total cost of a project, i.e. by quoting for a project, not solely on how many hours you spent working on a design.

    40 hours a week is 8 hours a day, 5 days a week - so your average full time work schedule. Perhaps new freelancers won't be able to bring in that much work but I would expect professionals to be able to.

    Sure, if you're a student or working part time, then you're not going to be able to work 40 hours a week - again, this is pretty obvious stuff. However, my point is that by charging too much he may lose the job - whether or not that matters too much to him, I don't know. Whilst some designers might used to charging those prices, don't assume that every graphic designer in any given situation should be doing the same.
  16. mcskillz

    mcskillz Member

    So you reckon £35 per hour for admin duties is acceptable? Might get a job as a receptionist for you then.
  17. Squiddy

    Squiddy Guest

    I'm sorry, where did I say that? I don't really understand what your problem is to be quite honest, and why you feel the need to make such wildly inaccurate claims on my behalf. Is there any particular reason?

    I thought it was just common sense that if you work, you charge for it.
  18. Jimlad

    Jimlad Well-Known Member

    Now, now, play nice you two.
    When I said "average is around £25-35" I really should've added that a student would realistically be charging less than that depending on his skill.
  19. balders

    balders Member

    Should their be more widely recognized price banding for freelancers?

    Like the do in film/tv production with runners, 3rd ad, 2nd ad and 1st. Its the same in AV production all freelancers generally charge the same.

    But wait....their are to many variable factors, right?
  20. captainrage

    captainrage Senior Member

    I find that it also depends who you're working for and if they will be able to offer you more work in the future.

    BBC don't even pay £35 per hour for freelance design..

Share This Page