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Is this a modern web developer?

Discussion in 'Website Design Forum:' started by Jazajay, Jan 5, 2012.


Is this guy classed as a web developer?

  1. Yes

    0 vote(s)
  2. No

    0 vote(s)
  3. Maybe

    1 vote(s)
  1. Jazajay

    Jazajay Active Member

    Right I put this on another thread but it so should have its own as I am curious to see if website development has come so far that this is now classed as somewhat of a norm.
    I had this conversation today at work with, and his job title is, a web developer who was having FTP access problems:

    Me: Hi is Tom there?
    Tom: Speaking
    Me: Hi Tom I understand you are having some problems accessing the FTP?
    Tom: Yeah entered the username and password but it says they are incorrect.
    Me: Okay what are they are I'll check them
    Tom: <Gives details>
    Me: Strange they are correct, what host are you trying to connect to?
    Tom: Don't know

    Me: Okay well in the host section you need to enter <Give him IP address>

    Tom: Is this on the website as I can't see it?
    Me: What website?
    Tom: Yours
    Me: Sorry what?
    Tom: Do I enter these on your websites login screen?

    Me: No you need to enter them into a FTP client.
    Tom: O okay
    Me: Have used an FTP client before?
    Tom: No

    After this I then had to explain what a FTP client was and how to use it as he hadn't used one before, but he must have put websites together by clicking the CMS button in the CPanel and then using the CMS install area to install templates, I guess.

    Now my question is, is this guy a web developer?
    He's definatly not a designer, so does developer cover him?
    I hate to say this but I think technically it may do as he can develop one, clearly I don't think he can code one, but he can add extentions and stuff. So is this a modern web developer?

    Its interesting when you think about it. :)
  2. No.. is the answer I give.. Its quite possible he's a middle man who doesn't know about anything (i've dealt with a few companies who have had a senior developer / designer as an administrator only.. not as someone who knows how to actual develop or design anything)..
  3. Levi

    Levi Moderator Staff Member

    Nope, that's a lacky who has been given computer duty lol....
  4. Jazajay

    Jazajay Active Member

    Well thats what I thought at first, as I was mocking it in the other thread, but when you think about it actually surely a developer is someone who can expand a website, develop it futher than when it was supplied.

    Now CMSs allow people with little knowledge to do this via extentions. Normal day to day people are lets face it scared of CMSs and really don't know how to use it even after training and lots of it. He clearly has "developed" a website before, extented it, or at least thats the impression I got, he may not have a clue about coding but does he need to to develop it?

    It's interesting, I think, when you capartmentalize a developer like that, well I think so anyway.

    Personally a site done by his kind of developer IMO wont work, they never do a lot more tends to be needed to be able to get sites even CMSs to work and he just wont have the ability in my opinion. But that doesn't mean he can't develop it more than a standard client who is handed a CMS, which is the point he's added extentions developed it and developed its functionality so in theory he is a website developer as he has developed a website via plug and play technology.

    Personally if hes a developer then I am something else, :lol:

    But I don't know maybe you could class it as a CMS developer, or CMS extender IE its a bit like a data entry position but for web development. Still a web job. I'm not sure is my honest answer because it is above the average joe, but not as good as well us, most of us, so its something else, something new?

    And which one of you didn't vote as mines the maybe? :blink:
  5. Levi

    Levi Moderator Staff Member

    anybody who has to deal with online stuff on a regular basis should at least of heard of the term ftp etc.

    Mind you, my host can add files via a web interface too so maybe that's how 'Tom' has done things in the past....
  6. richimgd

    richimgd Member

    Generally all developers should be able to use an FTP client and certainly know what one is - so no he sounds like a noob. Also merely installing WordPress (or any other CMS) themes and plugins does not make you a web developer or a web designer since you are neither designing something bespoke or developing something bespoke - simply modifying another designer or developers work inside their predefined parameters does not make you a designer / developer!
  7. Jazajay

    Jazajay Active Member

    Oooo I feel like I'm going to be difficult. :)

    So whats a Joomla developer, or JQuery developer for that then?
    It could be argued that a Joomla developer is someone who sets up Joomla, joomla database, installs extentions breezing forms, configures them, configures Virtuemart etc....and gets it to work if you haven't used Virtuemart or breezing forms before but you are a developer by the known idea of the term, then you may not have a clue or struggle to do it, but they don't technically need to code as I would class it.

    What about someone who developes JQuery plugings?
    TBH I don't have a clue, nor do I want to, but they do and they are using other developers code to do it.

    But by building a site in Word press or Joomla you are developing a website, even if it is just assembling plug and play technology.

    What about a html/Javascript developer that uses JQuery or MoolTools to put a gallery in place for example. They have used another developers code but they would both be classed as developers. But they have still both just used plug and play technology rather than their own.

    I suppose what I mean is, and many people may not like this, and lets forget about the quaility of a site it would produce. But if someone can build a website, develop it further on a day to day basis surely that makes them a developer....of some sorts?
    If not why not because they have developed a website above and beyond the bare skeleton that it starts out to be. The websites evolved now how that website evolved is irrelevant really, because it still has.

    I suppose I'm just fasinated by this idea.....for some reason. :D
  8. Levi

    Levi Moderator Staff Member

    there's always one.. :p
  9. Jazajay

    Jazajay Active Member

    I know. :cry:
  10. Squiddy

    Squiddy Guest

    I think if someone were to have a title such as web developer, it would be assumed that the person, both from clients and peers alike, would have a decent understanding of website development in general. As you all know, website development is the process of launching a website and so includes things such as web hosting, domain registration etc - not just simply how to click a few buttons on cPanel.

    Now, in reality his title should be something more akin to IT Guy. He knows bits and pieces but he's certainly not deserving of a professional title such as web developer. The fact that he's trying to log onto his own website through yours is, well, laughable at best - for a web developer. (For an IT Guy that's fine, I don't expect him to know everything) That shows he has no concept of domains or servers, what, does he think every website is hosted on the same server...?
  11. richimgd

    richimgd Member

    Ok I replied to that without really explaining myself.

    Somebody who installs a WordPresss theme not designed or built by them as the basis for a website they are making does not mean they designed or developed the website per se. To design a website means you actually put pen to paper (or mouse and keyboard to monitor) and plan out and imagine how you want the website to look and how you want it to work in response to your clients brief. To develop a website is to take the design and intended functionality and code it until it looks and works exactly how the designer imagined it. Right down to each and every pixel matching the design.

    Simply installing someone elses theme and changing a few images around and some text totally skips the whole design and development process! It is going through this process which makes you a designer / developer hence why I say if you skip this you are not (in my eyes) a designer or developer.

    Every client is different and every website is different. Its highly unlikely that a theme will match your clients requirements exactly. Even if a theme matches your clients’ needs by 95% (and forget that hundreds of other websites out there are using the same theme so that is originality out of the window!) it makes you lazy by using it because you can’t be bothered to figure out how to resolve the remaining 5% of the requirement. If the best you can do is browse a bunch of templates and use that as the basis for your website (that you neither designed or developed yourself) then in my eyes you are not a web designer or web developer and certainly when you start at a job and realise that you have been asked to design something from scratch and develop it from scratch without basing it on anyone else’s work then you will struggle because you are too used to looking through a list of themes and using the one as a basis for a design – that is just plain lazy in my opinion and takes creativity out of the process entirely. The real work is when you design something from scratch and no matter how tricky part of it might be to make, you stick at it and build it exactly how you imagined because you don’t want to compromise your original and creative idea. If you cut corners you don’t learn how something is done and that’s what separates the talented from the not so.

    Of course every web designer / developer will install WordPresss plugins or jquery plugins etc which are other peoples code – it’s how they are used and if they are done in way which complements the design. I see too many websites where you can clearly see the ‘designer’ has just dumped a jquery plugin onto it without even attempting to make it complement the design. It’s what I have written above which communicates what I was taking about when I explain what I think the role of designer and developers are.

    I don’t mean to rant – I’m just a little tired. ;)
  12. dave.rees

    dave.rees Junior Member

    The quick answer is No, as stated earlier he is probably a "middle man" clearly anyone who has the word "web" in their job title should know what a FTP client is.

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