Buying a Wacom Intuos pro pth-851

spike

New Member
Hello there, i am new on this forum. In the past few months i was learning about graphic design and digital drawing. The situation as now is not very good for tourism and I thought about changing careers, so i thought about why not graphic design? The (digital) drawing is more like a unfulfilled dream of mine, i like to draw but never had the right touch for it. Anyway, in my country i was looking for a tablet and I found one. Its used but it looks its in good shape. Of course i will test it. But the real question is. Should I buy a Wacom Intuos pro pth-851? I know, it's an older model and i really don't plan to buy a new one for more money, electronic here i very expensive so o thought to buy a used one for a cheaper price. So, i would like to hear opinions from more qualified people.

Thank you very much for your answers :)
 

Levi

Moderator
Staff member
The situation as now is not very good for tourism and I thought about changing careers, so i thought about why not graphic design?
Going to be blunt here... don't assume you can just switch to graphic design and make a living without any sort of experience, training or skill.. and I don't mean a few months learning about it (from I assume youtube). Having a dream and access to the software/hardware doesn't suddenly make you someone who should be selling design services.

We have had so many people come onto the forum saying they want to setup a graphic design business without experience, some not even out of high school, I find it best to temper expectations early on, especially when their only feedback is usually friends and family who aren't as 'honest' or 'critical' as clients would be. It's not an easy field to work in even with skills and experience.


As to the intuos... it still has drivers available so it will be fine if it works.
 

spike

New Member
Going to be blunt here... don't assume you can just switch to graphic design and make a living without any sort of experience, training or skill.. and I don't mean a few months learning about it (from I assume youtube). Having a dream and access to the software/hardware doesn't suddenly make you someone who should be selling design services.

We have had so many people come onto the forum saying they want to setup a graphic design business without experience, some not even out of high school, I find it best to temper expectations early on, especially when their only feedback is usually friends and family who aren't as 'honest' or 'critical' as clients would be. It's not an easy field to work in even with skills and experience.


As to the intuos... it still has drivers available so it will be fine if it works.
Of course, i am fully aware of that. It will take some time to learn it completely. Talent and skill are completely different things and where talent stops skill continues. Anyway, thanks for the reply (y)
 

sprout

Active Member
I agree entirely with Levi. If you stick around, you will see exactly what he means about wannabe designers armed with optimism and alacrity and little else who come here asking for a 3-line how to on building a career as a designer.

Most of us around here, who are seasoned designers, with more years of experience than we care to think about, will likely tell you of similar paths, of either education and experience or working their way up from within the industry. It takes a lot, lot longer than a few months.

My own experience after leaving school with reasonable A-levels, was to do a 1-year foundation course (a requirement to get in to the colleges I wanted to back then, even with A-levels), then a three year degree course (for which, I had to race 35 other people for my place). Once I had completed my degree, getting a job was still pretty competitive. After a fair bit of trawling a portfolio around design companies in London, I got a break. I worked there for almost 5 years. I learned a lot, made mistakes, earned victories, pulled a lot of all-nighters and did a solid month of 18-hour days on one particularly heavy project. Only after this, did I feel equipped to even think about going freelance.

This is not to put you off. If you want to do it, it is an incredibly rewarding career, but it’s tough and there are no easy routes. If you want to do it, do it the right way. The way I did it is not the only way. You can work your way up from an entry level job in the industry, but if you want experience in a top agency, then they are more and more going to expect a degree. Not because the degree in itself is the silver bullet – there are a lot of talented people who didn’t go this route – but what it does is weed out those people who think design is a cool career and haven’t put in the hard yards.

There are so many people out there doing exactly what you appear to be wanting to do, that it ends up being a bottom-feeding frenzy for $50 logos. This serves nothing other than reducing clients’ expectations of quality and driving prices downwards. Moreover, and most importantly, it simply doesn’t work for clients, so they end up pissing money away on adornment.

Design is about problem-solving and not about pretty. It involves an understanding of how the human mind works, how it accepts and processes visual information. It involves an understanding of typography at a fundamental level. It involves… it involves a lifetime of study. It is one of those subjects that the deeper you go, the deeper it goes.

What it is not, without sounding too scathing, is a love of drawing and a Wacom tablet – which is still the best you can buy, to my mind, by the way, for a designer. That said, if I focussed solely on illustration, I’d use an iPad and pencil every time. This is exactly what I use when I do illustration work. For design work, always a Wacom.

What do you want to be, ultimately? A graphic designer? An illustrator? If the latter, what area of illustration? Even for the former do you want to specialise or be a generalist?

Again, I am not trying to put you off, but like Levi, hoping to help you go into it with your eyes open.

Do you have samples of work? If so, post them here. You’ll get an honest – if not always easy to swallow – critique. This is important. You need objective opinions from people who know what they are doing. No point even wasting your time if you don’t have talent and/or aptitude to start with. If you do, there are lots of people around here who will be able to help nudge you in the right direction.

Good luck.
 

sprout

Active Member
Of course, i am fully aware of that. It will take some time to learn it completely. Talent and skill are completely different things and where talent stops skill continues. Anyway, thanks for the reply (y)
Ah, I see you responded to Levi as I was writing – I do seem to have a habit of turning a response into a tome!
 

spike

New Member
I agree entirely with Levi. If you stick around, you will see exactly what he means about wannabe designers armed with optimism and alacrity and little else who come here asking for a 3-line how to on building a career as a designer.

Most of us around here, who are seasoned designers, with more years of experience than we care to think about, will likely tell you of similar paths, of either education and experience or working their way up from within the industry. It takes a lot, lot longer than a few months.

My own experience after leaving school with reasonable A-levels, was to do a 1-year foundation course (a requirement to get in to the colleges I wanted to back then, even with A-levels), then a three year degree course (for which, I had to race 35 other people for my place). Once I had completed my degree, getting a job was still pretty competitive. After a fair bit of trawling a portfolio around design companies in London, I got a break. I worked there for almost 5 years. I learned a lot, made mistakes, earned victories, pulled a lot of all-nighters and did a solid month of 18-hour days on one particularly heavy project. Only after this, did I feel equipped to even think about going freelance.

This is not to put you off. If you want to do it, it is an incredibly rewarding career, but it’s tough and there are no easy routes. If you want to do it, do it the right way. The way I did it is not the only way. You can work your way up from an entry level job in the industry, but if you want experience in a top agency, then they are more and more going to expect a degree. Not because the degree in itself is the silver bullet – there are a lot of talented people who didn’t go this route – but what it does is weed out those people who think design is a cool career and haven’t put in the hard yards.

There are so many people out there doing exactly what you appear to be wanting to do, that it ends up being a bottom-feeding frenzy for $50 logos. This serves nothing other than reducing clients’ expectations of quality and driving prices downwards. Moreover, and most importantly, it simply doesn’t work for clients, so they end up pissing money away on adornment.

Design is about problem-solving and not about pretty. It involves an understanding of how the human mind works, how it accepts and processes visual information. It involves an understanding of typography at a fundamental level. It involves… it involves a lifetime of study. It is one of those subjects that the deeper you go, the deeper it goes.

What it is not, without sounding too scathing, is a love of drawing and a Wacom tablet – which is still the best you can buy, to my mind, by the way, for a designer. That said, if I focussed solely on illustration, I’d use an iPad and pencil every time. This is exactly what I use when I do illustration work. For design work, always a Wacom.

What do you want to be, ultimately? A graphic designer? An illustrator? If the latter, what area of illustration? Even for the former do you want to specialise or be a generalist?

Again, I am not trying to put you off, but like Levi, hoping to help you go into it with your eyes open.

Do you have samples of work? If so, post them here. You’ll get an honest – if not always easy to swallow – critique. This is important. You need objective opinions from people who know what they are doing. No point even wasting your time if you don’t have talent and/or aptitude to start with. If you do, there are lots of people around here who will be able to help nudge you in the right direction.

Good luck.
Yeah, i am aware of it, it will take long time. But that will not stop me. Besides I am more of the "i like to learn new things" guy, this is like an investment for myself. Maybe it will pay out in the future maybe it will not, i don't know. But it will not stop me. You can say I am overly optimistic but in reality I am a realist. A friend of mine said also the same for Apple products (may or Ipad) to use for illustrating, like, they are the best for it. The truth is, I am not an Apple user (Microsoft Android 4 life). But it can change of course, overcome and adapt. But like is said on the beginning, electronic in my country is very expensive. So, right now I don't need any apple product.

Thanks for the answer (y)
 

Levi

Moderator
Staff member
Yeah, i am aware of it, it will take long time. But that will not stop me. Besides I am more of the "i like to learn new things" guy, this is like an investment for myself. Maybe it will pay out in the future maybe it will not, i don't know. But it will not stop me. You can say I am overly optimistic but in reality I am a realist. A friend of mine said also the same for Apple products (may or Ipad) to use for illustrating, like, they are the best for it. The truth is, I am not an Apple user (Microsoft Android 4 life). But it can change of course, overcome and adapt. But like is said on the beginning, electronic in my country is very expensive. So, right now I don't need any apple product.

Thanks for the answer (y)
I know this will seem like a strange thing considering how much we say get a wacom on here... but how much are you likely to pay for the second hand wacom?

While not 100% wacom level, I'd maybe suggest a huion kamvas 13 (reviews seem pretty positive) could be comparable with the older model and you also get a screen to work on (makes a difference)
 

spike

New Member
I know this will seem like a strange thing considering how much we say get a wacom on here... but how much are you likely to pay for the second hand wacom?

While not 100% wacom level, I'd maybe suggest a huion kamvas 13 (reviews seem pretty positive) could be comparable with the older model and you also get a screen to work on (makes a difference)
Thanks, i considered also a Huion model. It was actually between Wacom and Huion. Unfortunately i couldn't find that Huion here, most of them didn't here about it (one even asked is this a new Wacom model :ROFLMAO:). I found here one Kamvas 20 but its almost 700 euro. And buying it from another country, plus shipping plus the taxes I would end up paying it even double from the original price.
 
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